Andrew Bostom writes in The American Thinker:
The Rahman “apostasy” case in Afghanistan should have been a stark wake up call. But even in Iraq there was an early, concrete sign (February 2004) of things going awry: the refusal of the interim Iraqi government to allow its ancient, historically oppressed (often brutally so) Jews to return in the wake of the 2003 liberation. Singling them out was agreed upon absent any objection, except for the dissent of one lone Assyrian Christian representative in the interim government, who knew well what such bigotry foreshadowed: the oppression and resultant exodus of the Assyrian community, which is now transpiring. And last spring came this harrowing story about Shari’a and Sistani-supporting women in the Iraqi Parliament: (Iraq’s women of power who tolerate wife-beating and promote polygamy):As a devout Shia Muslim and one of eighty-nine women sitting in the new parliament, she knows what her first priority there is: to implement Islamic law. When Dr Ubaedey took her seat at last week’s assembly opening, she found herself among an increasingly powerful group of religious women politicians who are seeking to repeal old laws giving women some of the same rights as men and replace them with Sharia, Islam’s divine law.We have a moral obligation to oppose Shari’a, which is antithetical to the core beliefs for which hundreds of thousands of brave Americans have died, including, ostensibly, 3000 in Iraq itself. There has never been a Shari’a state in history that has not discriminated (often violently) against the non-Muslims (and Muslim women) under its suzerainty. Moreover such states have invariably taught (starting with Muslim children) the aggressive jihad ideology which leads to predatory jihad “razzias” on neighboring “infidels”—even when certain of those “infidels” happened to consider themselves Muslims, let alone if those infidels were clearly non-Muslims.
That is the ultimate danger and geopolitical absurdity of a policy that ignores or whitewashes basic Islamic doctrine and history, while however inadvertently, making or re-making these societies “safe for Sharia*)”—as in Afghanistan, Iraq, Gaza, and now, likely, an Hezbollah-dominated Lebanon.
Read it all.
Shariah law is sexual and religious apartheid
Again, if you are a stickler for documentation and sources, you must get Mr. Bostom's book. It as superb collection and review that you are going to find.
all that precious American blood for Sharia?I bet none of them new that.When goergie boy meets his maker,he is gunna have a lot of angry Army,Marine,Navy,Air Force men and woman to answer for.I hope God leaves it up to them,if they want to keep him there,or send him to hell.
My nephew, who spent many summers with us, visited again after his recent graduation from Army Basic Training and Advanced Infantry Training.
I queried him a bit about what his drill instructors had told him about the Army's mission in Iraq. He told me that most of the drill instructors told him he'd be going there "to kill habib." After a bit more light questioning, he told me that American solidiers also build schools.
I asked him if he knew much about Islam.
Not much, I'm afraid.
Its difficult enough in the UK to stop the lobbying for Sharia family courts and laws in Muslim dominated areas what chance has the west of influencing Muslim countries...
We are wasting and sacrificing our Young men and women on a fools errand.
Lets be honest if we did not require the Oil and they produced only dates we would have left them to their squalid mores and religion with no further ado.
Makes me think, almost, that Cindy Sheehan might have a point after all.
"...if we did not require the Oil"
Absolutely! What is even more tragic is that much of the oil in Iraq is near Mosul in what is, historically and legally, the territory of the Christian Assyrians. However, the US, the Brits, and even the Israelis, insist on giving control of all this oil to the Kurds and looking the other way while they commit genocide against the Assyrians.
Over 300,000 Assyrian and Chaldean Christians are now refugees in Syria and Jordan, with little hope of seeing their homeland again. This is an outrage that the world ignores. Although the Kurds, Shi'ites, and Arab Sunnis all hate each other, they are in full agreement on destroying this last Christian nation in the region.
While the world moans about the squalor and poverty in the "Palestinian" Muslim refugee camps, no one notices these Christian refugees. Incidently, the real Palestinians, i.e,. the Christians of Bethlehem, Ramallah etc. are not in squalor but have become successful in exile. Many hope to return if Israel will ever get the sense to expel the Muslim interlopers masquerading as Palestinians.
all that precious American blood for Sharia?I bet none of them new that.When goergie boy meets his maker,he is gunna have a lot of angry Army,Marine,Navy,Air Force men and woman to answer for.I hope God leaves it up to them,if they want to keep him there,or send him to hell.
Why don't you refraim from being a "self-appointed" spokesman for those courageous fallen military men and women in Iraqi. Regardless of how you or I feel or anyone else feels about the war, many of them gave their lives for something they believe in deeply. Don't diminsh that by taking a cheap shot at the President.
In addition, as a veteran myself (not of the Iraq war), I wouldn't want someone like you speaking for me. I know the rest of the infantry platoon I was in wouldn't either, that's for sure....
Thirdly, it's best you don't speak for the souls in Heaven. You shouldn't be hoping that anyone goes to hell, you should be hoping for a change of heart. Leave the judging up to God, it's not for you to be the final word on the ultimate and eternal destiny of anyone elses soul.
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/CalThomas/2006/08/17/the_convert&comments=true#d556efdd-9b02-45da-b8f5-16f92027df42
oh, sorry. this is a better form of the link to Cal Thomas's latest column:
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/CalThomas/2006/08/17/the_convert
All non-muslims are treated as second class citizens in countries like Malaysia and yet those very citizens in numerous cases are thriving economically.
Reminds me of the times when we had slaves.......did we not eventually abolish slavery, so likewise, Malaysia has been independent for about fifty years now, so do you not think that eventually the "dhimmi" laws would be gone ?
PS the dhimmi laws in Malaysia are not nearly as bad as the slavery laws we used to have.......any comments ?
Once again its the same old same old moral equivalence tune churned out by loveverybody and all his previous aliases like peacenlove etc. The US abolished slavery following the civil war. The UK abolished it in 1833. We are still waiting 150 years later for the Islamic world to produce a Lincoln or a Wilberforce. Slavery was only notionally abolished in Saudi Arabia in 1962. Far from abolishing dhimmi laws, these laws have become stricter with the Muslim population becoming the majority in Malaysia. This is happening in a Malaysia which is 51% Muslim, and even you ought to be able to work out the percentage non-Muslim population of Malaysia. And when the Bumiputra system comes in with this bare majority Muslim population, it can mean only one thing - non-Muslims - the most educated people in Malaysia will leave in droves for places like Singapore, Australia etc and contribute to a society which values them. Why should they prop up a Muslim population that wants to grab everything without doing anything to merit it? This is how Muslim countries degenerate into backward crapholes, and let this Malaysian experience be a warning as to what happens should our Western countries become majority-Muslim, as some in Western Europe are forecast to be by the end of this century on present demographic trends.
"Reminds me of the times when we had slaves.......did we not eventually abolish slavery, so likewise, Malaysia has been independent for about fifty years now, so do you not think that eventually the "dhimmi" laws would be gone ?
PS the dhimmi laws in Malaysia are not nearly as bad as the slavery laws we used to have.......any comments ?"
-- from a posting above
No, the "dhimmi laws" -- that is, primarily the Bumiputra system that is a disguised Jizyah, and other disguised versions of the Shari'a laws covering the legal status of non-Muslims (see Antoine Fattal)--are not quite as bad, in Malaysia, as slavery, but so what? Slavery has existed all over the Muslim world, and indeed the Jews in Yemen and in many other places were treated as chattel slaves. For example, the British scholar R. S. Serjeant, who spent time in Yemen, described how even well into the 20th century if a "Jew belonging to Arab Tribe A" was killed by an Arab who was a member of Arab Tribe B" then an Arab who was a member of Arab Tribe A could, in retaliation, "kill a Jew belongong to Arab Tribe B." For the Jews killed on both sides, what a relief.
And should one ignore the fact that slavery is part of Islam, and always has been, and always will be because it is legitimized in the Qur'an and Hadith? No one, not a single Muslim, ever rose up against slavery. It was stamped out, where it was stamped out, by the efforts of Western powers -- France in North Africa, and the British, using naval power, in the Persian Gulf. The full story of the attempt to end the Arab slave trade in Africa, which began far sooner, and ended much later (and now has come back,in Mauritania and Sudan and elsewhere, for the Arabs see nothing morally wrong with slavery, and while the trade in white slaves ceased when the Europeans became strong enough to repel Musliim slavers raiding along their coasts or their shipping -- as with the Barbary Pirates -- black Africans never stopped being enslaved, and are so, with greater force today in West Africa, now that the French are gone, and in Sudan (now that the influence of Western powers, once present in what was the "Anglo-Egyptian Sudan," ended leaving the blacks in the south to the mercies of the Arab Muslims in the north).
The "dhimmi laws" in Malaysia, far from getting milder and on their way out, have steadily been strengthened. They did not exist under the British, and it was only after independence, and as the Muslims went from being a minority to now a slight majority, that they have little by little imposed that collection of laws, including the Bumiputra system. No, the "dhimmi" system not only is not, as the poster above suggests, on its way out, but the condition for Chinese and Hindus is getting steadily worse as the Muslim parties become ever more open, and ever more intent, on the spirit and letter of the Shari'a, that is of the Qur'an, the Hadith, and the example of Muhammad from which the Shari'a is derived.
The poster has it exactly backwards in Malaysia, where things are getting ever more unpleasant for non-Muslims, as they have in so many other places -- Indonesia, and Pakistan, and Sudan, and Bangladesh, wherever a country formerly under some kind of civilizing influence lost that influence, and Islam, only Islam, took hold of the minds of men.
Muslim apologists would do well not even to mention the word "slavery" if they wish to fool Western Infidels. Slavery is part of Islam, justified by Islam, justified every day, and every week, by the good Islamic clerics of Saudi Arabia and elsewhere who make clear that slavery can never end because it is part of Islam. It was only through Western pressure, in fact, that slavery was finally formally outlawed, in 1962, in Saudi Arabia -- but it continues, in less formal ways, especially in the trade within Saudi Arabia in southeast Asian girls for all kinds of purposes.
Quite enlightening, on the subject of white slaves, is Giles Milton's "White Gold" about a Cornishman seized by Muslim coastal raiders and brought to Morocco where he lived, with other white slaves, for years, under the rule of Moulay Hassan. And for black slaves, Jan Hogedorn's "The Hideous Trade" about the Arab slave trade in young black males, castrated on site, with only 10% of them surviving the journey to the slave markets of the Muslim world (where they were sold as eunuchs to be used for harems and other domestic purposes) should be consulted. The Arab slave trade claimed many more black African victims than the Atlantic Slave Trade, and of course unlike the Atlantic Slave Trade, does so right up to today -- and will tomorrow.
Jan Hogedorn's "The Hideous Trade" about the Arab slave trade in young black males, castrated on site, with only 10% of them surviving the journey to the slave markets of the Muslim world...
Wouldn't Muslim slave traders, over time, have modified that cruelty in order to minimize the obviously colossal impracticality of it? Wouldn't they have wanted, say, at least a 50% survival rate (and even that would be barely tolerable for most practical minded traders of any commodity) of the subhuman beasts they were using for economic purposes -- fairly easily doable, one supposes, by simply minimizing the "castrations on site" and providing other minimal insurances of physical well-being for their human chattel? I know Muslims can be stubbornly stupid and fanatical, but even this stretches credulity.
Spirit Of 1683 stated :
Once again its the same old same old moral equivalence tune churned out by loveverybody and all his previous aliases like peacenlove etc. The US abolished slavery following the civil war. The UK abolished it in 1833. We are still waiting 150 years later for the Islamic world to produce a Lincoln or a Wilberforce.
My comment:
Yes, the US abolished slavery but blacks were still second class citizens.
For example, between 1877 and the mid-1960s. Jim Crow was more than a series of
rigid anti-Black laws. It was a way of life. Under Jim Crow, African Americans were
relegated to the status of second class citizens.
So if you take 1776 as the year of independence, it took America about 185 years to
give blacks more rights and even to this day, blacks feel like second class citizens.
Malaysia and other independent Muslim countries have not had their independence
nearly as long as the US, before giving blacks more rights.
EVEN THOUGH NON-MUSLIMS ARE SECOND CLASS CITIZENS IN MALAYSIA,
THEY ARE STILL ABLE TO THRIVE ECONOMICALLY AND WERE ABLE TO VOTE
RIGHT AFTER INDEPENDENCE, UNLIKE THE BLACKS AND WOMEN IN THE US
Spirit Of 1683 stated :
Slavery was only notionally abolished in Saudi Arabia in 1962.
My comment:
Like said previously, it took America 185 years to give blacks more rights but in
Malaysia and other Muslim countries, non-Muslims were given more rights than
blacks in the US including the right to vote, right after independence
Spirit Of 1683 stated :
Far from abolishing dhimmi laws, these laws have become stricter with the Muslim population becoming the majority in Malaysia.
My comment:
Yes, but non-Muslims in Malaysia had the right to vote immediately after
independence and they are thriving economically in Malaysia.
Non-Muslims in Malaysia never experienced the suffering of the Indians and Blacks at
the hands of the American government.
Spirit Of 1683 stated :
And when the Bumiputra system comes in with this bare majority Muslim population, it can mean only one thing - non-Muslims - the most educated people in Malaysia will leave in droves for places like Singapore, Australia etc and contribute to a society which values them.
My comment:
There is no evidence of non-Muslims leaving in droves to other countries because
non-Muslims have never suffered in anyway in Malaysia.
The radicalization of the Muslim population is due to decades of Western powers
being militarily involved in the Muslim world.
Spirit Of 1683 stated :
Why should they prop up a Muslim population that wants to grab everything without doing anything to merit it?
My comment:
Grab everything ?
do you have evidence of this ?
There is no evidence of the Malaysian government grabbing anything of
substance from non-Muslims. Please give me an example.
Spirit Of 1683 stated :
This is how Muslim countries degenerate into backward crapholes, and let this Malaysian experience be a warning as to what happens should our Western countries become majority-Muslim, as some in Western Europe are forecast to be by the end of this century on present demographic trends.
My comment:
Backward crap holes ?
Has turkey or any majority Muslim country generated into crap holes ?
Countries like Dubai look like modern western countries, so do countries like
Malaysia and Turkey, in fact, other than Muslim countries in
South Asia, our allies, all other Muslim countries do not look like crap holes
"EVEN THOUGH NON-MUSLIMS ARE SECOND CLASS CITIZENS IN MALAYSIA,
THEY ARE STILL ABLE TO THRIVE ECONOMICALLY AND WERE ABLE TO VOTE
RIGHT AFTER INDEPENDENCE, UNLIKE THE BLACKS AND WOMEN IN THE US"
all non muslim in muslim lands suffer, they survive economically because non muslim are hard working people and basically the rest of the muslim live on welfare. After all the non muslims in malaysia are of chinese descent, which means hard working people.
"Yes, but non-Muslims in Malaysia had the right to vote immediately after
independence and they are thriving economically in Malaysia."
voting means NOTHING if you are murdered just because you are non muslim
"There is no evidence of non-Muslims leaving in droves to other countries because
non-Muslims have never suffered in anyway in Malaysia. "
there is no evidence because luckily non muslim malaysians love their country and would never give it up to muslim majority
"The radicalization of the Muslim population is due to decades of Western powers
being militarily involved in the Muslim world."
the radicalization of muslims is due to their breeding like rats, murdering non muslims and forced conversions, it's worldwide known.
"Grab everything ?
do you have evidence of this ? "
it's worldwide know that muslims being unable to achieve anything substantial in their lives, can only aim at looting what's not theirs. Like for example the taxes put in turkey against non muslim that basically looted lands and flourish activities from greeks and armenians and jews.
"There is no evidence of the Malaysian government grabbing anything of
substance from non-Muslims. Please give me an example."
you are deeply ignorant
here's the link
Muslim government putting a sort of tax or unfair bill to pay only to NON- MUSLIM effectively ROBBING their money
http://mymalaysia.wordpress.com/2006/08/17/malaysia-muslim-laws-and-corrupt-politicians/
and it's only because my time is too precious to waste it with an ignorant like yourself, otherwise I would find more news
"Has turkey or any majority Muslim country generated into crap holes ?"
yes, turkey is a crap hole full of honor killing, nazi government, radical islamist that have nothing to envy to osama
"Countries like Dubai look like modern western countries"
Dubai is not a country, ignorant, it's a city. Everything in dubai is build and projected by westerners with petrol oil, it doesn't say anything about muslim "intelligence".
Oil under muslim lands is only a geological mistake.
When turkey looted all the money, lands and florid activities to greeks and jews they were so STUPID that they drove them to FAILURE because they aren't able to do anything.
Hugh stated :
Slavery has existed all over the Muslim world, and indeed the Jews in Yemen and in many other places were treated as chattel slaves.
MY COMMENT:
Slavery has been part of human history and is not the exclusive practice of only Muslims.
Hugh stated :
For example, the British scholar R. S. Serjeant, who spent time in Yemen, described how even well into the 20th century if a "Jew belonging to Arab Tribe A" was killed by an Arab who was a member of Arab Tribe B" then an Arab who was a member of Arab Tribe A could, in retaliation, "kill a Jew belongong to Arab Tribe B." For the Jews killed on both sides, what a relief.
MY COMMENT:
the 20th century has seen the radicalization of a minority of Muslims ever since a
group of Jews called the Zionists wanted to create the state of Israel and wanted to
expel any non-cooperating Muslim.
These Zionists did not give the necessary financial incentives, power sharing
agreements or diplomacy and because of this unfairness on the part of the Zionists,
the radicalization of the Muslims began which led to atrocities committed by both
sides.
Hugh stated :
And should one ignore the fact that slavery is part of Islam, and always has been, and always will be because it is legitimized in the Qur'an and Hadith?
MY COMMENT:
Slavery has been part of the bible too, but Christianity had a 600 year head start to
become more liberal and only in the 19th century did westerners abolish slavery.
Hugh stated :
No one, not a single Muslim, ever rose up against slavery.
MY COMMENT:
were not African slaves Muslim ? and were they not against slavery ? please explain this one, thanks
Hugh stated :
It was stamped out, where it was stamped out, by the efforts of Western powers -- France in North Africa, and the British, using naval power, in the Persian Gulf.
MY COMMENT:
Aspects of slavery were still being found in the US as late as 1947
offenses against the Thirteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution were being prosecuted as late as 1947.
Hugh stated :
The full story of the attempt to end the Arab slave trade in Africa, which began far sooner, and ended much later (and now has come back,in Mauritania and Sudan and elsewhere, for the Arabs see nothing morally wrong with slavery, and while the trade in white slaves ceased when the Europeans became strong enough to repel Musliim slavers raiding along their coasts or their shipping -- as with the Barbary Pirates --
MY COMMENT:
Slavery is officially banned in all the world, but what goes on has nothing to do with
Islamic terrorism. Slaves exist because there is an economic benefit, not because
Islamic terrorists are bent on making slaves out of unbelievers.
Hugh stated :
black Africans never stopped being enslaved, and are so, with greater force today in West Africa, now that the French are gone, and in Sudan (now that the influence of Western powers, once present in what was the "Anglo-Egyptian Sudan," ended leaving the blacks in the south to the mercies of the Arab Muslims in the north).
MY COMMENT:
What is going on in Sudan is a civil war and tribal laws are still in place with regard to
slavery.
Like I said previously, slavery continues unofficially not because non-Muslims
refuse to become Muslims but rather when one tribe conquers another tribe because
of the civil war, the vanquished become slaves.
This has always been the case in Africa where tribal laws sometimes due to war and
civil war, supersede the governmental laws.
Hugh stated :
The "dhimmi laws" in Malaysia, far from getting milder and on their way out, have steadily been strengthened.
MY COMMENT:
Can you please explain this ?
are the non-Muslims in Malaysia being enslaved by the Muslims ?
Non-Muslims in Malaysia are thriving economically and they had the right to vote
since Malaysia became independent, unlike the blacks, native Americans and women
in this country who did not get the right to vote after independence
Hugh stated :
They did not exist under the British, and it was only after independence, and as the Muslims went from being a minority to now a slight majority, that they have little by little imposed that collection of laws, including the Bumiputra system.
MY COMMENT:
can you explain the bumiputra system ?
is it a system that enslaves the non-Muslims ?
and if so, why are the non-Muslims thriving economically in Malaysia ?
Hugh stated :
No, the "dhimmi" system not only is not, as the poster above suggests, on its way out, but the condition for Chinese and Hindus is getting steadily worse as the Muslim parties become ever more open, and ever more intent, on the spirit and letter of the Shari'a, that is of the Qur'an, the Hadith, and the example of Muhammad from which the Shari'a is derived.
MY COMMENT:
Like I said, are the laws enslaving non-Muslims ?
if the dhimmi laws are getting stricter, do you not think non-Muslims would be getting
poorer and not richer ?
would you not think that non-Muslims would be scrambling to leave Malaysia ?
but non-Muslims are much better off in Malaysia today than they were just 25 years
ago.
Hugh stated :
The poster has it exactly backwards in Malaysia, where things are getting ever more unpleasant for non-Muslims, as they have in so many other places -- Indonesia, and Pakistan, and Sudan, and Bangladesh, wherever a country formerly under some kind of civilizing influence lost that influence, and Islam, only Islam, took hold of the minds of men.
MY COMMENT:
You have to give me a concrete example that is backed by some official document or
news from the respective governments to state that non-Muslims are becoming slaves
to Muslims or at least heading towards it.
Non-Muslims in Muslim majority countries might be discriminated against by certain
Muslims, but that kind of discrimination even happens in the US, but on the whole,
non-Muslims in Muslim countries not affected by war are treated as second class
citizens but not to the point of enslavement and non-Muslims do thrive economically in
all Muslim majority countries not experiencing wars.
Hugh stated :
Muslim apologists would do well not even to mention the word "slavery" if they wish to fool Western Infidels.
Slavery is part of Islam, justified by Islam, justified every day, and every week, by the good Islamic clerics of Saudi Arabia and elsewhere who make clear that slavery can never end because it is part of Islam.
MY COMMENT:
Slavery has always been part of every civilization and is now officially banned in all the
world , but slavery does exist on an unofficial basis not because Muslims want to
enslave non-Muslims but people of all religions derive an economic benefit in
trafficking in human beings in today's capitalistic world
"slavery does exist on an unofficial basis not because Muslims want to enslave non-Muslims but people of all religions derive an economic benefit in trafficking in human beings in today's capitalistic world"
A little sump'n-sump'n for the Leftists.
FedUp stated :
EVEN THOUGH NON-MUSLIMS ARE SECOND CLASS CITIZENS IN MALAYSIA,
THEY ARE STILL ABLE TO THRIVE ECONOMICALLY AND WERE ABLE TO VOTE
RIGHT AFTER INDEPENDENCE, UNLIKE THE BLACKS AND WOMEN IN THE US"
all non Muslim in Muslim lands suffer
MY COMMENT:
When you mean by suffer, are you talking about
lose of land, property and life ?
Non of those things occur officially in Muslim
countries.
Please give me a law in a Muslim country that
states that land, property and life can
be taken from a non-Muslim for being non-Muslim ?
FedUp stated :
they survive economically because non Muslim are hard working people and basically
the rest of the Muslim live on welfare.
MY COMMENT:
That might be so, but taking of life or property
from a non-Muslim is not officially
sanctioned, unless you can tell me what official
law sanctions it.
FedUp stated :
"Yes, but non-Muslims in Malaysia had the right to vote immediately after
independence and they are thriving economically in Malaysia."
voting means NOTHING if you are murdered just because you are non Muslim
MY COMMENT:
Is there an official law in Malaysia that
sanctions the killing of a non-Muslim for being
non-Muslim ?
FedUp stated :
"There is no evidence of non-Muslims leaving in droves to other countries because
non-Muslims have never suffered in anyway in Malaysia. "
there is no evidence because luckily non Muslim Malaysians love their country and would never give it up to Muslim majority
MY COMMENT:
You are right, because non-Muslims in Malaysia
have rights and would not give up
their rights and that is the reason they are not
leaving Malaysia, because they have
rights.
FedUp stated :
"The radicalization of the Muslim population is due to decades of Western powers
being militarily involved in the Muslim world."
the radicalization of Muslims is due to their breeding like rats, murdering non Muslims and forced conversions, it's worldwide known.
MY COMMENT:
Breeding like rats ?
Procreation is a blessing from God and its not
breeding and there is nothing animalistic about
it.
The reason you exist is because of a miracle and
every child born is a miracle from God.
If non-Muslims are being murdered, its not
because they are non-Muslims, just like America
has one of the highest murder rates in the
world, does not mean "Christians"
hate "Christians" ?
Forced conversions ?
If there are forced conversions, its the
exception and not the rule.
There is no official law in any Muslim country
that sanctions the forced conversion of a non-
Muslim.
FedUp stated :
"Grab everything ?
do you have evidence of this ? "
it's worldwide know that Muslims being unable to achieve anything substantial in their lives, can only aim at looting what's not theirs. Like for example the taxes put in turkey against non Muslim that basically looted lands and flourish activities from Greeks and Armenians and Jews.
MY COMMENT:
I am not familiar with this situation. Could you
please elaborate with some supporting
documentation, thanks.
If what your saying is true, why do non-Muslims
visiting Turkey state that the people of Turkey
are more friendly than the people in Europe ?
IF MUSLIMS EXIST TO ENSLAVE NON-MUSLIMS, WHY DO
NON-MUSLIMS HAVE A MORE FAVORABLE REPORT ABOUT
TURKEY THAN THEY DO ABOUT EUROPE ?
FedUp stated :
"There is no evidence of the Malaysian government grabbing anything of
substance from non-Muslims. Please give me an example."
you are deeply ignorant
here's the link
Muslim government putting a sort of tax or unfair bill to pay only to NON- MUSLIM effectively ROBBING their money
http://mymalaysia.wordpress.com/2006/08/17/malaysia-Muslim-laws-and-corrupt-politicians/
MY COMMENT:
I read that article you sent.
There is no incident in that article that
states that Muslims are either enslaving non-
Muslims or grabbing their property
FedUp stated :
and it's only because my time is too precious to waste it with an ignorant like yourself, otherwise I would find more news
MY COMMENT:
Could the reason that you do not have time is
because
its really hard to find news about Muslim
governments officially enslaving or taking over
the properties of non-Muslims because they are
non-Muslims ?
FedUp stated :
"Has turkey or any majority Muslim country generated into crap holes ?"
yes, turkey is a crap hole full of honor killing, Nazi government, radical islamist that have nothing to envy to osama
MY COMMENT:
That's not the definition of crap hole , is it ?
A crap hole is a place that looks like crap.
Honor killings is not sanctioned by any Muslim
government.
Nazis are not officially recognized by any
Muslim government.
Radical islamist teachings (which i think you
mean terrorism ) is not sanctioned by any Muslim
government including the government of Iran.
Yes, Iran supports Hezbollah, but it supports
Hezbollah as a resistant group to Israeli
incursions.
FedUp stated :
"Countries like Dubai look like modern western countries"
Dubai is not a country, ignorant, it's a city. Everything in Dubai is build and projected by westerners with petrol oil, it doesn't say anything about Muslim "intelligence".
MY COMMENT:
Yes, your right here, Dubai is not a country,
my apologies.
Muslims are not intelligent ?
what makes you say that ?
I have heard of a lot of Muslims who are
doctors and engineers and scientists and
entrepreneurs and businessmen.
FedUp stated :
Oil under Muslim lands is only a geological mistake.
When turkey looted all the money, lands and florid activities to Greeks and Jews they were so STUPID that they drove them to FAILURE because they aren't able to do anything.
MY COMMENT:
Geological mistake ?
what does that mean ?
Do you mean that the earth has a mind of its
own and makes mistakes like human beings do ?
When did Turkey loot land and money from Greeks
and Jews ?
and as I understand it, Turks were on the whole
more friendly
to Jews than the Christians were in Europe
during the time of the Ottoman Empire
HUGH STATED : about the Arab slave trade in young black males, castrated on site, with only 10% of them surviving the journey to the slave markets of the Muslim world
MY COMMENT:
For every horror story about how Arabs treat
their slaves, you can find equally horrific
stories in every non-Arab culture including how
Americans treated their own slaves.
Man's inhumanity to man does not depend on his
religion but rather on his own personal
depravity which has nothing to do with religion
I have copy-pasted most of "loveverybody"'s responses into a World file for future use, because I think they are a good example of the reigning template by which Muslims and (too many) Western Leftists alike try to dispute the anti-Islamic movement.
It probably would not have any practical effect to engage with "loveverybody" directly on his or her points, since he or she is probably one of those ideological machines of the Islamic and/or Leftist Borg. But there might be many Westerners on the fence out there for whom it would be instructive to construct point-by-point refutations of these ideologically boilerplate spasms as typed out by "loveverybody" -- if only because they are so dominantly protected (if not outright expressed) by Western PC Multiculturalism.
REMOTE CONTROL STATED :
Muslims and (too many) Western Leftists alike try to dispute the anti-Islamic movement.
MY COMMENT:
When you say anti-Islamic movement. By making a
comment like that, do you really expect genuine
dialog between the West and Muslim nations.
For example, Malaysia has 90% muslims in its
governmental jobs even though muslims comprise
60% of the population and in the private sector,
muslims comprise about 30% of the work force
while non-muslims comprise 70% of the private
work force. Is having 90% of muslims in the
government fair ? OFF COURSE NOT
BUT WHAT IS THE SOLUTION ?
The solution should be constant dialog,
diplomacy, financial incentives, psychological
therapies, security incentives and covert and
overt operations in order to bring muslim
nations into the 21st century.
Saying we are anti-islam is not going to help
matters and what really does not help matters
is the western military involvement in the
middle east ever since the Zionists without
proper negotiations, diplomacy, giving the
necessary financial and power sharing
incentives, pushed for creating the state of
Israel and things have been going downhill ever
since between muslims and non-muslims
COMPARED TO the 1800s, when Jews were
allowed in large numbers to settle in Jerusalem
by the muslim Ottoman Turks AND MUSLIMS AND JEWS
USED TO GET ALONG PRETTY WELL.
Please join in the discussion at the
conservative forum below regarding how to
prevent all future wars and terrorism :
http://forums.yaf.org/showthread.php?t=1617