If you believe that jihadists twist and hijack Islam, then you believe that either Waheed Zaman completely misunderstood whatever he learned at these Tablighi Jamaat where they taught "what Islam is all about," or that the Tablighi camps themselves were run by people who misunderstood Islam.
Of course, some people can swallow anything.
Tablighi Jamaat passes itself as a peaceful, moderate movement, but this is not the first time people associated with it have been involved with something more sinister.
"Student activist and trips to Islamic camp," from the Daily Mail, with thanks to Twostellas:
Waheed Zaman was a student activist who regularly attended Islamic camps, friends said yesterday.Zaman, 22, who was held in a raid in Walthamstow, is a biomedical science student at London's Metropolitan University, where he is head of the Islamic Society. The role brought him into contact with firebrand MP George Galloway.
He often went to the weekend camps in British mosques run by the Tablighi Jamaat movement, according to a friend.
The friend said he also attended the same mosque as two of the other suspects. The man, who would only give his name as Mohammed, 22, said: 'He is a good guy. If he sees any Muslims going wrong, he will have control over them, making sure they don't do anything stupid.
'He goes to the Queen's Road mosque in Walthamstow with Ibrahim Savant, who used to be called Oliver, and Usman Siddique.
'He used to go on Tablighi Jamaat camps, which is a group that preaches what Islam is all about.
'We would go away on weekend trips. All they do is talk about the beauty of Islam. They only teach peace.
'I am involved in Tablighi Jamaat and I am sure there is no one trying to pick up or recruit people from these camps.
'This has been a mess-up by the police.' Zaman's sister Safeena, 24, said his student role had brought him into contact with George Galloway many times. 'He saw it as his duty to stand up for his community and that's what led him to know George Galloway.'
Obligatory He-Was-A-Great-Guy Riff:
Another friend said: 'Waheed is very sociable. Everyone knows him. He has got white friends, black friends, and Asian friends.'He describes himself as British. He's a superman of Walthamstow. He has a good rapport with lots of people. He wants to be a doctor or a forensic scientist and I'm really upset to think this could have happened to him. He loves to play football, he supports Liverpool. I don't think he would have been mixed up in anything.'...
Neighbours said Khatib had just returned from a six-month trip to Pakistan.
Samantha Phillips, 18, a former school friend said: 'He used to always wear Muslim clothes and he used to pray about three times a day.'
Probably five, Samantha.
I just saw, on MSNBC, a father of THREE of the terrorists crying, and being comforted by a male friend who said "he will swear on the Koran" that his sons are innocent.
Of course they are innocent (of wrongdoing) for killing and plotting to kill kaffirs is good doing..following in the example of Muhammad and per his instructions.
Yet Britain and the world doesn't get it, the problem as we know is Islam, not "alienation" of Muslims or Israel or Iraq, but Islam and the Borg like identity muslims have...
Muslims remind me of that bug in Men in Black. The giant cockroach that got angry and murderous at anyone who "oppressed" an insect.
Synopsis, there is no such thing as an individual entity or sense of self in Islam, except for the cult of muruwwa (manhood, pride, arrogance, vengance).
The concept of muruwwa, seems to negate the concept that Islam is Borglike, however consider that despite Insh'allah fatalism, that Allah wills all, Muslims still blame "colonialism",Jews, Crusaders and other Kaffirs for their own ineptitude, failings, backwardness.
Islam is nothing but a classic study of logical contradictions, and unreason.
"If he sees any Muslims going wrong, he will have control over them, making sure they don't do anything stupid." Like he is in control of law and not local authorities, (aka, Sharia), which I would imagine is seldomly contacted. "They only teach peace." And we all know what "Peace" means in Islam and it's teachings. When we realize that they are speaking a different language, and when translation can be meaningful, then we will be done with this whole charade.
'This has been a mess-up by the police.' Zaman's sister Safeena, 24, said his student role had brought him into contact with George Galloway many times. 'He saw it as his duty to stand up for his community and that's what led him to know George Galloway.' And I would venture to say, what exactly is his community, the one with disregard for the police? Maybe one day I will own my own community, and lawforce, and disregard all practices of the infidel nation. If this is not sedition or perverted religous practices equal to hate crimes, or fascism at it's finest, then we all have a insidious right to overthrow every law ever written by legislature.
we have to think these muslims are living in the "Twilight Zone", rules only for them, and rules for others,ie non muslims. a bunch of guys going away to camp, what are these nothing but a bunch of get together with gay like atmosphere, talking nothing but peace,holding hands and singing kumbyeya, it seems more like the "Twilight Zone".
Islam's Success Based on Violence
While many Muslims claim Islam to be a religion of peace, history has shown over and over again that it is a religion based on a culture of violence. Against non-Muslims and women. Its oppression of women ensures that women remain subjugated to the male demands of cooking and cleaning and carrying babies. Its philosophy of convert or die has made it the fastest spreading religion in the world. Its success guarantees that Islam will never change. There is no logical reason for it to change. Violence will continue to be the key to its success.
David
True peace in Islam, which is what all Muslims speak about as if they were greenpeace. Means peace only when all religions are either exterminated, converted, submitted, or the prior which I have already mentioned. The only confusion comes from the proliferators of Islam that wish to confuse you, and all infidels, of the true nature of fascism.
He wants to be a doctor or a forensic scientist...
Atta was a civil engineer, Bin Laden is the product of a wealthy family that owns a heavy-construction firm, Ahmedinejad is a civil engineer. This 'superman of Walthamstow' was studying science.
So much for the theory that cultural 'enlightenment' purges whatever it is that drives these folks.
Isolation, containment, and harassment sure seem like better strategies than educating Egyptians in Montana.
While many Muslims claim Islam to be a religion of peace, history has shown over and over again that it is a religion based on a culture of violence.
No, we knew from about 623 AD exactly what the Moslem ideology project was about. Who cares what they do, listen to their scriptures:
Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax in submission.
--- God commanding Moslems to subjugate all non-Moslems in Koran 9:29
So there ya go.
True peace in Islam, which is what all Muslims speak about as if they were greenpeace. Means peace only when all religions are either exterminated, converted, submitted, or the prior which I have already mentioned. The only confusion comes from the proliferators of Islam that wish to confuse you, and all infidels, of the true nature of fascism.
True peace in Islam, which is what all Muslims speak about as if they were greenpeace. Means peace only when all religions are either exterminated, converted, submitted, or the prior which I have already mentioned. The only confusion comes from the proliferators of Islam that wish to confuse you, and all infidels, of the true nature of fascism.
During Jesus' Sermon on the Mount he warned his followers to beware of "wolves in sheeps clothing and false prophets".
I believe that Muhammad was a false prophet, and that Islam is a wolf in sheeps clothing -- as it appears peaceful, but in truth it is evil.
Jesus and Muhammad are not equal -- nor are their followers.
So we obviously have a problem that many wish to ignore. America is about, freedom of religion. Islam is about abolishing all religions and being the dominant one. How will we ever get around these problems? I would seek Jewish help. They have seen the intolerance of Islam for years that remain painful. Yet they still hold some sort of faith that all is not lost, and that we will never lick the boots of Muhammed.
islams worst nightmare would be winning, no one to hate, blame, or threaten. They would turn on thier own children and eat them.
I never meant for that blog to be submitted more than once, but I guess it rings true.
If you're in North America and want to get
a taste of Londonistan, visit Toronto.
Toronto's Muslim population has exploded, and
most of them are Pakistani and Iranians.
I wonder if our government is aware of the terrorist danger Canada's Muslim population poses.
America Caves In To UN and Hezbollah
There has been a common impression that modern science and modern education can make one less susceptible to jehadi propaganda and spread of modern education has been forwarded as one of the remedy to treat the spread of JIhad. But what I have seen in this case and numerous other cases that jehadi who have exposure to modern science are much more deadly. What is the remedy then? Would anyone share their views?
Pagan
Well we are talking about a peoples that think that Jews are rats cause rats will not drink camel milk, but will that of sheeps. What the hell is that? That is only one, there are tons of them, read the Aramic, Arabic book. It is like a mother goose story sung by a retard.
Hmmm cage a rat starve it and see if it is true. I'd bet another muslim lie.
He loves to play football, he supports Liverpool. I don't think he would have been mixed up in anything.'... - from the article
Sure. Anybody who plays soccer can't be bad (video here).
He's a Liverpool fan, eh?
Muslims are like zombies--they show certain outward
signs of normality, but look closely and you'll
see there is something terribly off about them.
I think that many of you are missing the essential point here. The plot to blow up several planes (probably sixteen) was, apparently, hatched by al-quaida, in some form or another, but was to be executed using British moslems, British airspace, British security, British airports and, by all accounts so far, materielle purchased in Britain. Obviously, my country is perceived by the islamofascists as weak and ineffective. However, this is not the case, since British Intelligence, British police, British financial institutions and British companies thwarted the proposed, alleged attacks.
Has it ever occurred to any of you in the USA that we Brits seldom say exactly what we mean, seldom give anybody a clue as to exactly what we think, seldom tell the whole truth, or indeed any truth at all when a lie might just, possibly, work better, seldom actually stick by any agreement which is not in our favour - in short, we are the past masters (by several hundred years) in the nefarious arts of taqiya and kitman.
Despite all sorts of attempts to impose Sharia Law upon us (or at least some parts of it) we have remained sublimely resistant to such proposals. For the vast majority of us the idea that we should help moslems to integrate (i.e. give into them) is still the most risible thing that we have ever heard. Moslems in British society, at all levels, remain beyond the pale, unintegrated, unaccepted, outcast, reviled, objects of ridicule and disgust. They have singularly failed to cross what we normally refer to as the marriage hurdle - the point at which an immigrant community can say it has been accepted (roughly, when about thirty per cent of marriages in such a community involve one or other of the partners coming from a long established (three-hundred years or more) British family.
Most of you in the USA have absolutely no conception of how little attention is paid by the average Brit to his/her government. The government has very little influence on our day-to-day lives. Most of us lie, cheat, twist our affairs and generally ignore the government. Most of us laugh at the idea that the British government has more than a passing reference to our lives. You probably think that we take elections seriously. Think again! For most of us they are nothing more than a glorified opinion pole and really we couldn't care less who is elected to represent us. Most British people see politics for the stupidity it really is.
Britain is not an easy country to govern. The official, known about by government, economy places us third or fourth in the world rankings of economies. It is generally estimated, however, by Her Majesty's Treasury, that the black (illegal - whatever the hell that might mean) British economy is four to six times larger than the official economy. Certainly, the strength of the British exchange rate (£ to all other currencies) is not supported out by the size of the official economy but is manifestly and obviously supported by the black economy.
Our society, likewise, is not summed up by simplistic newspaper reports, oversimplifications by line services such as Reuters or AP, wishful thinking by American freepers or stupidities vocalised by supercilious American government officials whose world view could be cogently summarised by the words of Sullivan - "It is much easier to make measurements than to know exactly what you are measuring".
It amuses me, and, I presume, most British posters to this site, that you Americans think that you can predict the future of the UK, predict what we will think or do, predict how we will feel and respond. We are a deeply violent people, a deeply duplicitous people, sneaky, without conscience (except where our own self-interests lie), self-centered and wholly pre-occupied by our own comfort and our own self-preservation. If the moslem invaders ever really do truly get on our wick then, believe me, we will deal with them ruthlessly, just as we always have done with every other immigrant group. We are not a pleasant people - read our history. Whatever fictions you Americans might entertain about us dispell yourselves of them. We are not nice and we bite.
For example, you helped us out in '39 through '45. You could have expected some degree of gratitude. Instead what you got was, in 1946, a prominent British politician saying, with the vociferous approval of most British people, "Damn the Americans, the most ill-bred, mongrel apologists for reaction whom I have ever encountered". We're nasty, and when the time comes we will be nasty again. Make no mistake, most Brits just don't like anybody else and that includes you (regretably - and the French, but then, who likes the French) and the moslems, with whom we will deal, in the appropriate fashion, at the appropriate time - and you probably won't like that, either.
Dominic.
Dominic; I've written off France but was thinking today that the British, with their proud history, which includes the Plains of Abraham (I went out of my way to visit it and, if you're interested, the French Canadians have turned it into a soccer field), would not shrink before the challenge that you have before you.
I'm sorry to hear that you don't like us. I like you, and am grateful for the work we've done together recently. At the risk of speaking for my neighbors, I'm not alone.
It sounds like you're feeling sensitive to critisism about being weak. I (we) don't believe it for a second.
Regards from New England;
They always try to justify their unpardonable behviour by citing "examples of atrocities on muslims". They should either think that we are all stupids or they themselves should be stupids not realise that, in the whole world today, muslims are the only oppressors living. As such, I think the one way of discouraging such stupidity would be to make statements like - Hey muslim, I would support any atrocity happening on any muslim in the whole world. If you can give me the details of who are the oppressors (like say, IDF) I will send money to them to continue doing what they are doing.
What do you guys think about such statements?
Dominic: what the lads at the pub think does not matter.
In my experience, British academics are very left-wing, anti-American, anti-Israeli and pro-Muslim.
Trying to convince an educated Brit that Muslim
immigration is dangerous will only make him
think that you're a racist BNP sympathiser.
No doubt, the old chestnut about Britain's foreign policy being to blame for radicalising young Moslems will once again be spouted by many Muslim leaders as well as by the usual nihilistic self-loathing left-wing nutcases who empathise with them. I'm pretty sure that Tony Blair's support for Israel is also going to be part of their grotesque rationalisation. Or perhaps it's their "disadvantaged" backgrounds, and limited opportunities in life such as only being able to study science at university. If only they had been brought up in Pakistan, where they would no doubt have had a more fulfilling and productive lives.
I think that "necessitasnonhabetlegem" (Dominic?) paints a rather cynical and partially untrue picture of us Brits. From my experience, the vast majority of Brits do like Americans, and indeed anyone else who treats them with respect. The canting and sickening pro-Islamist anti-American anti-Israeli it's-all-George-Bush's-fault the-Christian-fundamentalists-are-just-as-bad-as-the-Islamic-fundamentalists
what-about-the-Crusades? nonsense we often hear is usually spoken by useless ersatz left-wing academics. I take great delight in telling such people that I think George Bush is a very decent man and a rather passable President.
Northumbrian; Siempre Fidelis. But your food needs some work. Looking forward to visiting someday;
How about this?
Much more here:
http://www.westernresistance.com/blog/archives/002765.html
This is similar to National Socialism and Marxism-Leninism, other forms of totalitarianism. They are also deterministic. For the Nazis, someone's behaviour was to be explained in terms of his "race"; for the Marxists, by "production relations". In both cases, as the view is deterministic, if it were true it wouldn't make any sense to see the object of hatred as culpable, since he has no choice in the matter. In practice, you'd have trouble finding more vindictive moralizing than that put out by these two totalitarian movements.
Then you have the most senior Muslim Police Officer in the country telling us that Muslims feel alienated-when at my university the Islamic Society has 1500 members, far more than any other. If you go around with only your eyes showing so even your friends can't recognise you you may feel alienated-by yourself.
"islams worst nightmare would be winning, no one to hate, blame, or threaten. They would turn on thier own children and eat them."
Don't forget that the Sunni and Shi'a are at each other's throats already. It would certainly be in our interest to encourage this infighting. But of course to hear the apologists for Islam talking , you'd think all the carnage in Iraq is the work of the Americans. Truth-inversion, as usual.
And I mean any other society, not university probably!
Swear on the Koran, that means a religious duty to lie to the infidel, what a twat.
As soon as I hear the words he was a good Muslim or a he is a devout Muslim then it is beyond all doubt that they are guilty.
I happan to like and respect Americans, though I can't stand American business leaders, who talk about cutting costs etc. and take huge options as unallocated costs.
I also am aware of the attitude towards the British Empire prior to and after the Second World War. It was a long term strategic goal of the USA to see the end of the British Colonial Empire, which was achieved via financial means and our own decline.
Domonic, we have had over 20 years of PC rammed down our throat, I see a sullen apathy, moaning and bitching, but standing up for nothing, no we Brits are sheep, lead by lambs.
My only hope from this sorry attempt to kill people is that those middle English Brits who had their holidays disrupted will harbour a bit more anger towards this awful religion and its barbaric followers. The pathetic fire-bombing of a door at a Mosque was laughable as a response.
Dominic I have lived in England 50 years and do not recognise the British people you describe. There is some truth in what you say but then there always is.
Your knowledge of history is at best superficial and I could take issue with you on many points but have time for a one point only. But first I would say that with all its faults I will shout “God bless America” and losing the American War of Independence was the best thing Britain ever did.
People should understand that America's aid to Britain in the second world war was a strategic necessity and had very little to do with preserving freedom and democracy. To quote Corelli Barnett the British Empire was “A useless ragbag of an empire put together from centuries of treaties at the end of wars with other European countries”. But the prospect of Britain and of its territories, worldwide military bases and its vast but unexploited resources falling under efficient German organisation was something the United States could not allow. That was a reason for America's assistance. The US ambassador at the time Joe Kennedy thought that Britain best interest was to do the best possible deal with Germany to preserve its empire and quit. Many leading British politicians thought the same and it was only Churchill, the left and the Civil Service that wanted to continue the fight. You are unaware that one of the United States prime war aims as a good republic was the dismemberment of the British and French empires. They went so far as to lock up the French colonial officials in Hanoi and put Ho Chi Min and his group in power. One imagines to their later regret. They also tried by covert means to allow the Chinese reoccupy Hong Kong before the British. This might explain your 1946 quote.
As one who has read history extensively I can tell you that the only people the British have not the slightest compunction about oppressing is the British. An English friend not long ago said that he thought that political repression in Britain today was probably the worst on earth. As I know of men who have lost their jobs for being overheard using the word “Paki” as a simple noun without any pejorative additions I would agree with him. You're probably not aware that local papers have been threatened with closure by non-government agencies for printing perfectly true negative stories about Muslims and according to the BNP website one of their members is doing two and half YEARS for insulting a failed Iraqi asylum seeker who did not speak English.
History shows that when faced with a really nasty problem British policy is always to do nothing and hope it goes away. As Corelli Barnett also said “There is nothing the British political system finds so thoroughly disagreeable as a decision”.
As to the current British Government's attitude to the Muslims I am absolutely baffled and for you to be right I can only conclude that they have a “Cunning plan” (Only British posters will understand this quote).
The only conclusion I can reach is that in common with other European governments and a Muslim poster on this site, they have accepted that our grandchildren I going to be Muslims and they may as well get the best deal possible.
Assalamau-Laikum all,
An interesting thread. I am certainly somewhat amused by Dominic's piece about what British peoples WERE like. He is living in the past...the gory (or was that glory) days of the empire. Where the peoples of Britain were white colonist superimists....stiff upper lip, starched collar, premium white gloves together with our their own form of kitman and tiqquia ...what!
Dominic...like so many things in history those days are GONE...get used to it...the only way to bring them back is for mass deportation of virtually all ethhnics, leaving Britain for the whites once again....BUT it isn't gonna happen anytime soon or ever again!
Instead, despite what has happened recently, by some foolish misguided lunds such as these 24, inshallah the glory days of Islam will be upon us soon.
Why do I say this with confidence. You mark my words that the government will want to understand Islam more...look at the needs of the muslims..., provide the mechanisms for further integration by giving our muslim speakers more prominent roles ...councillors, lawyers, and especially positions in government, urdu and Islam in schools.
In a classic reversal of kitman and tiqquia, the government's ultimate try will be to have a muslim foreign sectarary...you mark my words.
They will think "Our foreign policy is cause of these problems", the prime minister of the next generation will say....well let a muslim help formualate this.
Next...damn..still problems at home...so let's get a muslim home secratary...that should fix the problem.
Dominic, there is no going back...I was amazed to learn that there are already 7 mosques just in High Wycome...I have been to that little hillside town when studying in the UK...what remarkable progress in such a small time span...Allah SWT be praised...I thought that only the north of England was being completely dominated over by muslims...but no ...Masahallah good progress in the south too.
Another point I was intrigued with is ...students like these vermim ...back in Pak for 6 months....what's happened to his course at uni? Why do they need 6 months here...if you want "progress"..then limit the time to 6 weeks or lose the citizenship..unless you have a work permit ....do you have the guts to pass such a law?
Pak is full of 10,000 to 20,000 Maddrasses...we have all sorts of peoples "retarted vermin here too...only too ready to teach" ...is it necessary for for them to be here for so long?....I tell you ...keep a look out for these peoples.
Islam must form a hugh part of British society...but only pecefully...why don't these lunds understand that...get that home and foreign secrateries to be muslim...yes I'm sure that a good step forward....boy I love a plan coming together.
"My only hope from this sorry attempt to kill people is that those middle English Brits who had their holidays disrupted will harbour a bit more anger towards this awful religion and its barbaric followers."
Daffersd, my thoughts entirely!
necessitasnonhabetlegem so you prol speak for yourself, as far as being ungrateful, l take that as a European trait. for having an underground econonmy, that is caused by being taxed to death. same shit in Canada. now that you can bite, well where is it?
Naseem,
Did I misread that or did you just descibe the Muslims - the real ones - as "retarded vermin"?
What are you, a racist or something? LOL
Re: British jihad suspect Tablighi Jamaat member
Another example of the "altered mind that alters all" (I think it was Edmund Burke who said that).
On a related matter, I would not be surprised if Islamic-Fascists stage an event that is an attack upon one of their own mosques (even an explosion that kills innocent Muslims) as a deceptive measure to play the role (a la the Nazi-CAIR propagandists) of victim. Though many Infidels are seeing through the diversion scam of Orwellian "Islamophobia", these altered minds do not have good judgement re the reactions, re the feelings of Infidels, and are likely to think that such a set-up will do the trick to divert and invert the issue away from the Islamic-Fascist attempt to commit mass-murder in the sky over the Atlantic.
The above thought (re a set-up)ran through my mind when I recently saw the Nazi-CAIR propagandists on CNN's "Situation Room". The urgent calls of The-Nazi-CAIR-Propagandists for protection of mosques may be hint (a view into their mind) that there are Islamic-Fascists who are contemplating an atrocity (probably a bomb) at a mosque for propaganda purposes. In any event, the calls for "protection" should be answered by a permanent presence of police and FBI, etc. at the mosques.-LOL
Some refreshingly anti-dhimmi sentiments from the British government. Let's hope they stick to this more robust line.
LONDON (Reuters) - The government on Saturday rejected as "dangerous and foolish" accusations that its foreign policy heightened the threat of terrorist attacks after police foiled a plot to blow up transatlantic airliners.
In an open letter to Prime Minister Tony Blair, British Muslim groups and politicians said his policies on issues like Iraq and the Israel-Hizbollah war were putting civilians at increased risk in Britain and elsewhere.
Thirteen months after four British Islamist suicide bombers killed 52 people on London's transport system, British Muslims fear they are being demonised because of extremist militants.
"We urge the prime minister to redouble his efforts to tackle terror and extremism and change our foreign policy," said the letter, whose signatories included six politicians from Blair's Labour Party.
But ministers were quick to reject claims that their policies had given ammunition to extremists.
"No government worth its salt should allow its foreign policy to be dictated to under the threat of terrorism," Transport Secretary Douglas Alexander told BBC Radio.
"The contemporary challenge we face is how do we maintain the safety of the British public, how do we uphold the perfect right of people to debate these issues but never to succumb to what I think would be both dangerous and foolish."
"GRAVEST ERROR"
Foreign Secretary Margaret Beckett was equally forthright, saying people who blamed the country's foreign policy for the terrorism threat were making "the gravest possible error."
"This is part of a distorted view of the world, a distorted view of life. Let's put the blame where it belongs: with people who wantonly want to take innocent lives," she said.
"In an open letter to Prime Minister Tony Blair, British Muslim groups and politicians said his policies on issues like Iraq and the Israel-Hizbollah war were putting civilians at increased risk in Britain and elsewhere."-from an article posted by JFGR
I think they are preparing for an attack on a mosque with the intentions of using it for propaganda purposes. They are preparing a Reich-stag fire. I have a strong intuition re this.
JFGR
Sorry but I think the latest news is that Blair has agreed to meet those "Muslim leaders".
JFGR
Sorry but I think the latest news is that Blair has agreed to meet those "Muslim leaders".
Terror in action is the result of well formed passion in motion - bred and cultivated over 1500 years by Islam.
There is a fundamental difference between the belief systems of Islam, Judaism and Christianity. Islam looks to a god not of love, but of deviance, deception and dominance..kinda sounds a little satanic, doesn't it? But that is not my point. Stay with me here...
Judaism has a very wise, patient and committed God, and is the same God of Christians who see him as Almighty and the God of Love, forgiveness,and the father of the Holy Trinity.
My point here is about the passion with which the Islamic jihadists blindly execute their belief systems to annilate the infidels. Their passion appears to be absolute.
Now here it is: Where is the root of our passion?
Are we willing to strap on a set of homemade bombs and stroll into a mosque, embassy, get on an Iranian Airline, etc., and then blow ourselves up with the only motivation as becoming a martyr and living a hedonistic life forever.
Where is the commitment to this ideal in the free world?
What is the state of passion of the average non-muslim citizen in any western country? I believe the unconsciousness to this dynamic is why there is no action / re-action by the masses of the "free world".
One thing that may have put a damper on it is the American and egalitarian idea of freedom of speech, freedom of religion. But unfortunately these are the very things being used against us as an achilles heel.
Oh, and the belief that suicide has a deleterious effect upon our quality of life in the afterlife... not reward. We see it as suicide. They see it as martyrdom. Big difference. We also achieve martyrdom, but not through agression, but through persecution or dying for the love of God.
It is time for the passion of the sleeping giant to wake up. Before it takes another unthwarted attack on the ideals of freedom to ring the bell. The bell is ringing as loudly as it can.
How about we have some Freedom Cells? Foment the same "unknown" dynamic.. quietly assimilating into their cultures waiting for decades and generations to activate our ideology of freedom?
Do we have this focus? Do we have the time at this point?
--- God commanding Moslems to subjugate all non-Moslems in Koran 9:29 So there ya go.
Posted by: Alarmed Pig Farmer
Allah isn't God. Allah is the NAME of the Islamic god(ilah)
Qur’an 20:8 “Allah! There is no Ilah (God) save Him. His are the most beautiful Names. To Him belong the most beautiful attributes.”
The Koran tells you that Allah is the Islamic rock gods NAME and clarifies it 54 times.
"ilah' is the Arabic word for god.
The Name Allah is itself derived from the early rock worshiping pagan Meccans calling their black rock "the god most high" (Al ilah ta' ala)
Allah is a contraction of that, and hence the name "Allah" was born.
When Mohammad first hatched the idea to become a prophet, he didn't call his god "Allah" at first, He called it Ar-Rahman. The reason for this was because the Meccan's were already using the name "Allah" for their rock, along with the names Al Uza, and Al lat, the names of Allah's daughters, who were literaly chips off the old rock god Allah.
If you read early Islamic "scripture" the life of Mohammad, you will notice these Pagan Meccans saying things like "by Allah, Mohammad, we will never bow to your god Ar-Rahman". They said "By Allah" an awful lot in those early chapters of Ishaq and Tabari.
Mohammad used Ar Rahman as his gods name all the while that he was expelled from Mecca and lived in Medina. It wasn't untill he massacured his own tribe (the meccans) and forcefully took control of the Ka'aba (the rock god shrine, and the black rock called Allah) that he dropped the name Ar rahman and started using "Allah". Ar- Rahman was never used again in the remaining Koranic Sura that he invented. ("Allah" was always solving Mohammad's problems)
--- God commanding Moslems to subjugate all non-Moslems in Koran 9:29 So there ya go.
Posted by: Alarmed Pig Farmer
Allah isn't God. Allah is the NAME of the Islamic god(ilah)
Qur’an 20:8 “Allah! There is no Ilah (God) save Him. His are the most beautiful Names. To Him belong the most beautiful attributes.”
The Koran tells you that Allah is the Islamic rock gods NAME and clarifies it 54 times.
"ilah' is the Arabic word for god.
The Name Allah is itself derived from the early rock worshiping pagan Meccans calling their black rock "the god most high" (Al ilah ta' ala)
Allah is a contraction of that, and hence the name "Allah" was born.
When Mohammad first hatched the idea to become a prophet, he didn't call his god "Allah" at first, He called it Ar-Rahman. The reason for this was because the Meccan's were already using the name "Allah" for their rock, along with the names Al Uza, and Al lat, the names of Allah's daughters, who were literaly chips off the old rock god Allah.
If you read early Islamic "scripture" the life of Mohammad, you will notice these Pagan Meccans saying things like "by Allah, Mohammad, we will never bow to your god Ar-Rahman". They said "By Allah" an awful lot in those early chapters of Ishaq and Tabari.
Mohammad used Ar Rahman as his gods name all the while that he was expelled from Mecca and lived in Medina. It wasn't untill he massacured his own tribe (the meccans) and forcefully took control of the Ka'aba (the rock god shrine, and the black rock called Allah) that he dropped the name Ar rahman and started using "Allah". Ar- Rahman was never used again in the remaining Koranic Sura that he invented. ("Allah" was always solving Mohammad's problems)
Naseem
you look into your little crystal ball and you see what you want to see, with typical muslim logic you see your plan developing.
This is no plan - it is the end game of a decadent people who, many centuries ago abandoned logic and reason , like the cowards they really are and followed the insane rantings of a lunatic -muhamed.
The previous writer who tried to excuse britain was both wrong and right.
He was right in that the thin veneer of british politeness is just that and underneath there is a heart of darkness just waiting to come out into the light ( hope you like the religious symbolism).
This will end very badly for the muslim people - if you know anything about european history it is a history of blood - we are the real destoyers of worlds and when we want to there is no-one who can do it more eficiently.
So dream on naseem - hubris is very quickly followed by nemisis - and you people are crashing headlong to meet yours.
yours faithfully
a polite british person
If you're in North America and want to get
a taste of Londonistan, visit Toronto.
Toronto's Muslim population has exploded, and
most of them are Pakistani and Iranians.
I wonder if our government is aware of the terrorist danger Canada's Muslim population poses.
Posted by: george_rem
No way. The worst problem in Canada is Quebec.
It's just like france, an so is the attitude of the blind and ignorant. Toronto isn't near as bad, although they do have their share of Islamic mouthpieces there as well.
The Muslim population in Canada is somewhere around 600,000 (probably a bit more)Most of them are in Quebec and Ontario, the other place where they are more populous is Vancouver.
We have about 10 million in the USA. It seems that the largest concentration is around Michigan/ Buffalo area, which is very close to Canadian concentrations just across the border.
The first Islamic state will probably be Michigan. Every 3rd baby born there is named Mohammad.
Naseem, assyougottaklickem to you too. In case you haven't noticed, your group failed to implement their terrorist plans, just as hezbulluh is being defeated by the Israelis. You will never see islam and your false prophet (pigs be upon him) leading the Brits around by their noses like he does you ignorant Pakis. The Brits aren't that stupid. They aren't third world losers like muslim countries. The more of this type of violence you people create, the more disgusted civilised people get with your cult and the more your cult's members will be converting to Christianity like they are in the USA. Dream on, old woman. We've heard your rantings before from Hitler, Stalin, et al. Your society will end up on the garbage dump of history like theirs did.
Naseems he/she is not a real muslim, she/he would not be allowed to go round the black rock at mecca, yet he/she sill likes to lick the sandals of muslims. poor wretch, Naseem you are better at goin back to being a Hindu, at least you could particpate in their rituals. ho Naseem there is sitll a small window of a chance to leave your furniture store, go outside take off the burka an liberate yourself now.. hey you will need to shave though, for those hairy muslims when burqas go off. Naseem for once you can see the "winning side", every plot your paki muslims throws at us is stopped in its tracks. are no you not getting tired of being on the losing side? has your son arragned another marriage for you, so you could be at least useful in your society?
Naseem/
johnmac has the right of it. To say the things you say simply proves that you don't know us nor understand the way British society works - as you proved on another thread, recently. Moslems are kept separate in British society - the fact that they want to be separate helps us in this.
You have no conception of the violence in Britain nor our struggles to contain it. You have no conception of the cynicism with which we Brits view the political processes and the PC academics and politicians. You simply have no idea of the danger that moslems living in Britain are in. We can go for centuries, if need be, keeping ourselves under control but when we snap, when we finally get fed up, the bloodiness and the violence erupts and we destroy that which we don't like.
Those days are not gone, Naseem, and they have nothing to do with empire or the past, as you try desperately to assert, they are just a characteristic of the mongrel race we are. Anyway, most Brits don't have any conception of empire, and empire, much as you might find this hard to believe, never really mattered to the people - it was just something outremer inhabited by foreigners whom a few strange Brits thought that they should keep in order. We are just a nasty people. Do not mistake the vapid outpourings of the politically correct for the true feelings of the average Brit. You don't live here and you can't know. In recent years our nastiness and our brutality have been re-inforced by new genetic and cultural components from the Caribbean and the far east.
We try to keep the whole thing under control with our famous politness - stiff upper lip(!) - but mostly that's just a fiction to make the rest of the world feel better and a device for defusing situations on a small crowded island that would, in a sane society with more space, lead to violent conflict. Have you never heard about the most common British challenge to a fight. It's really simple and should show you what I mean. It's runs thuswise: "Are you looking at me?"
Just looking, not even in a wrong way, can provoke a Brit to violence.
So, Naseem, are you looking at me?
Dominic.
Naseem,
I can't see how you can rejoice at the recent near-tragedy in England. Of all the people, Pakistanis should thank Britain for it's very birth. Had it not been for the British, India would not have never split into two. But then, gratitude is not an Islamic strength. But what is shockingly horrific is how Pakistan pays back Britain. Everything from abusing / draining govt. systems to intimidating the very Brits who gave Pakistan birth, at all levels. Is there any boundry where Pakistanis will stop with their nefarious and anti-British activities? Or is it that dark cult of Islam that has no honesty/integrity as most of us at JW know? Ofcourse, we at JW know that Islam, under the cover of a 'religion' is a murderous, blood-thirsty and a barbaric cult, covered by a deceptive smoke-screen. Sitting here, I can see through the Muslim MP's letter criticizing Bitish foreign policy. It is a blatent attempt to cash-in on the fear of terror caused by 7/7 and the latest failed plot. The loyalties of muslim MP's clearly lies with the UMMA Al-Islamia, out to destroy an infidel country. Rightly, the British Foreign Office Minister Kim Howell has not only denied the charges, but seeing through the blackmail, has criticized the letter. So, the smoke-screeen is lifting, truth is emerging. But the troubling qustion is: Is Islam so dark and deceptive that it does not care for people. I mean, look at you. You profess Islam as the best system on earth ever. Yet, you complain about the discrimination (it is laughable that the Islam you profess does not allow you to visit yhour holy shrine). You have the nerver of rejoicing the destruction of the very Infidels you beg to put in a good word for Ahmadis. Islam or no Islam, where is your conscience? where is your integrity? What values do you have, if any? Again, looking at the background that you come from, inspite of the education in yes, same Britain, you rejoice destroying, you and your entire community suffers from loyalty to and only to UMMA with total disregard to Infidels. UMMA is like a community of termites that eat up the very woodwork they reside in. What surprises and disappoints me is your lack of morality, all the while, hiding your true agenda behind the cover of 'Religion of Peace', whereas Islam has no characteristics of a religion, except the membership. But then, cults boast of membership as well.
So we obviously have a problem that many wish to ignore. America is about, freedom of religion. Islam is about abolishing all religions and being the dominant one. How will we ever get around these problems?
Posted by: zooboomafoo at August 11, 2006 11:36 PM
Indeed, these are problems of a fundamental nature, I mean, freedom of religion is a constitutional freedom, freedom of speach is a constitutional freedom and yet, Islam forbids these very fundamental freedoms. If any proof was needed,there it is. And like you, I worry too.. how will we ever get around these (fundamental) problems?
They always try to justify their unpardonable behviour by citing "examples of atrocities on muslims". They should either think that we are all stupids or they themselves should be stupids not realise that, in the whole world today, muslims are the only oppressors living.
Posted by: SafetyFirst at August 12, 2006 01:48 AM
Oh Oh.. but if you look into the muslim mindset, all will make sense and also, see how stupid western governments and societies are. There not en atom of honesty in muslims. Add to that the agenda of complete domination (it helps if the agenda is hidden behind catchy 'Religion of Peace'), what better hostility (other than physicla attack) to blame everyone else? The worst is that the false blame will be busted, but then, there is no penalty to make false blames. Fromt here on, it only gets better for muslims. You see, fair and honest as western values are, a blame always taken seriously and responded to with proof of falsehood. But by then, western values are already on the back foot and there is more blame coming your way, before you have disproved the first. This puts western values always on the back foot. This strategy is also used in physical attacks. Western values require investigating, proving and punishing the crime appropriately. Islam sees this weakness (by the time investigation, proof and punishment is done), hundreds / thousands of Infidels are dead, which was the plan in the first place. Round I to Islamic agenda.
This bride of SATAN can never, no NEVER tell us again that she is moderate and peaceful!
She is a jihadist with exactly the SAME F******
mentality as the suicide bombers!
Take your praises to allah, aka satan, somewhere else naseem!
Posted by: americaningermany at August 12, 2006 01:12 PM
Yes, americaningermany, once and for all, irrefutably, Naseem has proved her own loyalties, which lie with Umma Al-Islamia, with the vile agenda of Islam, doing what muslims do best.. speead the cult of Islam, only difference between Usama Bin Laden and Naseem is that Naseesm does not hide and seems to be, against violence, but, given Islam condones lying to Infidels, who is to know the truth? But now, thanks to americaningermany, it is established once and for all, Naseem is an active Jihadist, with loyalty to Umma, hostility towards non-muslims and surrendered to Allah! So, beware, Ifidels.
Assalamau Laikum AIG, Alert,
YOur posts lumping me a jihadist are complete nonsense...i refute them completely.
I despair at what damage these Paki idiots are doing to Islam. DO NOT EVER make the mistake that I support them ...I DON'T.
What I AM saying however is that (despite these idiots) Islam will dominate peacefully...despite fits and starts.
And if I openly praise on the number of mosques in High Wycombe for exqample..this DOES show the progress Islam is making in that town...and long may it continue.
Ahmadis have a problem with Sunnis..yes, we have problems with parts of the Koran... yes ...but are we PEACEFUL muslims ...Yes.
So I am asking for the spread of peaceful Islam...I've never made a secret of that...but that does not make me a jihadist...simply a peaceful moderate muslim.
Assalamau Laikum AIG,
You say "The fact that you rejoice over Britain's destruction (what you hope for) proves where your loyalties lie".
Show me EXPLICITILY "where I rejoice over Britain's destruction".
I have NEVER said such a thing, that is a WICKED lie that you are fronting to make me look bad infront of all the other readers.
Either show me, or admit that you lie...one or the other.
My loylties lie with peaceful Islam....I have never made a secret of that. So what If I praise that there are 7 mosques in H Wycombe...these would have been build via proper planning permission with the local council...praising these is not breaking the law or destroying...instead it is enhancing britian...taking it closer to Allah...and that can only be a good thing.
As to your definition of "jihad"...it is such a wide range you show as to render it useless ...once again....I want to see a proper narrow definition tying me to violence...if you cannot....then stop lying.
AIG, you have lost, I'm afraid that you are simply blined from the truth and perhaps YOU are willing to say anything to get Islam out of your (balding, since you keep pulling it) hair...get a grip woman ...things have only just kicked off.
americaningermany,
What we call as 'destruction', muslims call as 'construction'. Construction of an islamic state. And destruction of Britain in this case.
Assalamau Laikum all,
Say can you all smell that...ugh foul smell.
Oh wait it's ok I know the source now...it's all the bullsh*t AiG is speaking...phew panic over!
"Obligatory He-Was-A-Great-Guy Riff: "
Isn't that what is said about neighborhood pedophiles when they are caught?