Here's the latest in the Jihad Jane/Jihad Jamie case. "In Ireland, a Hearing on a Plot to Kill a Swedish Cartoonist," by Eamon Quinn and John F. Burns for the New York Times, March 15 (thanks to Bill):
WATERFORD, Ireland -- A late-night court hearing Monday in this quiet Irish town gave new glimpses into the case that American and Irish prosecutors are pursuing against a group of Muslims on both sides of the Atlantic suspected of plotting to kill a Swedish cartoonist who depicted the Prophet Muhammad atop the body of a dog.Five of the seven people arrested in Ireland a week ago have been released, the last of them shortly before Monday's hearing. But two others, an Algerian man and a Libyan man, were formally charged with relatively minor offenses that lawyers involved in the case said could keep them in custody while more serious charges, including conspiracy to murder, are weighed by Irish prosecutors. The lawyers said charges against the five others were also possible.
The Algerian who appeared in the Waterford court, named as Ali Charaf Damache, 45, was said by police officials to be suspected of being the group's leader. Mr. Damache, a 10-year resident of Ireland, was charged with sending a threatening computer message to another Muslim in Waterford. The Libyan, named as Abdul Salam al Jahani, 32, was charged with using a false name to obtain asylum status in Ireland in 2001. Both were ordered held without bail while an investigation continued.
No reference was made in the 15-minute hearing to the wider circumstances of the case, which has centered in the United States on a 46-year-old Pennsylvania woman, Colleen R. LaRose, a Muslim convert who adopted the pseudonym of JihadJane on the Internet, and has been in custody in Philadelphia since the fall on charges of linking up with militants overseas in a plot to carry out a murder, apparently that of the Swedish cartoonist, Lars Vilks.
The arrests in Ireland drew a second American woman into the case: Jamie Paulin-Ramirez, 31, from Leadville, Colo.. A Muslim convert like Ms. LaRose, Ms. Paulin-Ramirez is the wife of Mr. Damache, the Algerian charged in the Monday's hearing, according to a Waterford lawyer involved in the case, and is several months pregnant. She was one of the seven arrested last Tuesday, but was released on the weekend. [...]
Ms. Paulin-Ramirez's mother, Christine Mott, 59, said in an interview last week in Colorado that her daughter announced her conversion to Islam last Easter and became increasingly estranged from her family....
Hmmm. Now, why is that?
This is getting curiouser and curiouser.
Stepdad of this dizzy dame is a muhammadan revert,so I fail to see why she should be estranged from her family.
curious indeed!
"Ms. Paulin-Ramirez's mother, Christine Mott, 59, said in an interview last week in Colorado that her daughter announced her conversion to Islam last Easter and became increasingly estranged from her family..."
Why would this be so? Christine Mott's husband is a Muslim convert. Why would her daughter's conversion be a point of contention?
My, that was fast work on the part of Ali Charaf Damache. So Jamie Paulin-Ramirez, looking for love in all the wrong places, hath sown the wind, and reaped the whirlwind courtship, and now a baby will seal her but not -- as he had assumed, but in a different way -- his fate.
In Islam, the phrase "barefoot and pregnant" is always in play.
Some observations:
http://freemendo.typepad.com/undaunted/2010/03/this-bitch-jihad-jane------jihad-jane-aka-colleen-trailertrash-larose-jihadjane-licking-off-what-the-finger-bowl-missed.html
That's "barefoot, pregnant and in the kitchen."...or it was in the 50s at least...
The Muslims repeatedly claim that their god is merciful, and yet their people so little seem to be. Why not just forgive and forget about a stupid cartoon? Can't their god have mercy on the person who drew the thing? I guess not. This is why I'd have to respect other religions a bit more, even if I knew nothing else. A Christian or a Jewish person who really stood by their beliefs would tell them to give it up and move on, or pray for things to get better. Muslims seem to want to get so offended on someone else's behalf, that nothing else will do, but plotting an attack. That says a lot.
cut&paste
The Waterford St. Patrick's Day Parade is tomorrow. The grand marshal is a local playwright. The theme is "Play your Part". Mary O'Halloran makes history when she becomes the first ever lady Mayor of Waterford to oversee the parade. "Ireland is a very different country today than it was ten years ago. A host of international communities have made Ireland their home...We would dearly love the parade to reflect their cultures and customs and I encourage them to 'Play their Part'
Gosh and be gorrah!
Jihad Jane/Jamie have learned their Islam well.
Unlike most religions, Islam has commandments (114 Chapters worth) that are brutal and vicious.
Muslim Commandments - Thou shall Rape, Thou shall Kill, Thou shall Terrorize, Thou shall Steal, etc.
... was charged with using a false name to obtain asylum status in Ireland.
Asylum from what?
Ms. Paulin-Ramirez is the wife of Mr. Damache, the Algerian charged in the Monday's hearing, according to a Waterford lawyer involved in the case, and is several months pregnant.
....................
And we already have a good idea of the tender parenting Ms. Paulin-Ramirez-Damache will give this new child:
"The 6-year-old son of a Colorado nursing student who ran off to Europe to join a terrorist murder cell was brainwashed into a hate-filled Islamic fundamentalist zombie, his family said Saturday, The New York Post reported.
He was being turned into a baby bomber.
The 6-year-old son of a Colorado nursing student who ran off to Europe to join a terrorist murder cell was brainwashed into a hate-filled Islamic fundamentalist zombie, his family said Saturday, The New York Post reported.
"He said that Christians will burn in hellfire," the child's grandmother, Christine Mott, told The Post. "That's what they are teaching this baby."
...Her conversion was so complete, Paulin-Ramirez changed her son's name from Christian [yes, the boy's birth name was actually *Christian*—GI] to the Islamic name Walid after enrolling him in a fire-breathing Muslim school in Ireland.
........
more on what Jamie has been up to:
Her family said she struck up an Internet friendship with another Colorado radical, Najibullah Zazi, an Al Qaeda associate who pleaded guilty last month in a plot to set off bombs in the New York subway system.
...As she began to become more deeply involved with Islam last summer, Paulin-Ramirez hit it off with failed terror bomber Zazi.
"When I saw him [Zazi] on TV, I said 'That's the fool Jamie's been talking with,' " George said. "She was on the line with Zazi and also with 'JihadJane,' all talking at the same time."
Paulin-Ramirez befriended a Pakistani man over the Internet, and offered to help him come to the United States to take flying lessons.
........
*Flying lessons*—good God.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/03/14/american-linked-terror-plot-brainwashed-year-old-son-family-says/
Hello, Folks.
I am somebody who comes to this website often, because although I disagree with Robert Spencer and his colleagues quite a bit, I do agree that there is a problem with Islam (just as there are problems with other religions).
But the thing is, I'm getting quite bored with the usual articles, and also quite bored with the commentary responses.
I am now coming out of my lurking to ask this million dollar question to everybody, including Mr. Spencer:
If Islam is as truly evil as you say it is, then how come you aren't making more of an effort to convert Muslims to Christianity or any other religion?
Example: The Jews had plenty of opportunity to convert the Palestinians to Judaism. That would've solved the Israeli-Palestinian conflict right then and there. And it still could, if Israeli Jews put in the effort.
So what is it? Are you going to make the effort to convert Muslims, or are you going to crack jokes from here to kingdom come?
Muslim libel tourist to sue Motoonists in British dhimmi court where conviction is likely and will apply across Europe: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/denmark/7457611/Defamation-case-over-Prophet-Mohammed-cartoons-to-be-held-in-Britain.html
That's what this website is trying to do, by pointing out bad bits of Islam and how it connects it to Islam.
Though it's more of a blog relating to jihadists and the such, Faith Freedom International is much better in terms of conversion, as is The Religion of Peace. Helped me convert from Islam.
al-Manac,
Tell ya what.
You go to Palestine, Iran, Saudi Arabia or any other muslim country you choose.
Then YOU try to convert the natives to Judaism, Christianity, Buddhism, Wicca, or any other religion you like.
See what happens to you.
>>That's what this website is trying to do, by pointing out bad bits of Islam and how it connects it to Islam.>>
The only thing that I see at this website is a lot of joking about "inbred camel-jockeys" and "barefoot-and-pregnant" women. Now is this a very good way to make a Muslim see your point? Not f**king likely.
Look. The vast majority of Muslims live in the Third World, which means they don't use computers, and they don't speak English. So how are you reaching them through this website? You aren't.
Here's an idea. Mr. Spencer has made millions of dollars from all of his books and his speaking fees. He has friends in high places. How about setting up a shortwave radio station in Arabic and other languages for the purposes of conversion? Because if you believe that Islam is evil, then that's the next logical step. Not bitching about CAIR till hell freezes over.
>>>al-Manac,
Tell ya what.
You go to Palestine, Iran, Saudi Arabia or any other muslim country you choose.
Then YOU try to convert the natives to Judaism, Christianity, Buddhism, Wicca, or any other religion you like.
See what happens to you.>>>
You don't need to physically go to Muslim countries in order to convert them. What you need is a shortwave radio station. Millions of people in the Third World, including Muslims, possess a shortwave radio.
Also, you can set up AM radio stations in nearby non-Muslim countries that are powerful enough to be received in Muslim countries.
Mr. Spencer, with his money and his friends, is capable of doing both.
Tell ya what, al-Manac; you need to spend lots of time here reading the posts and the various books and links before you get to leap onto your high and noble horse and begin with the slings and arrows.
You're a rookie who doesn't, apparently, care to learn but only wants to make waves by tossing assertions about as though you're the truth wizard, and posing questions your answers to which are supposed to make you seem wise and caring and everyone else look like a putz.
Not gonna work here.
"al-Manac" wrote:
But the thing is, I'm getting quite bored with the usual articles, and also quite bored with the commentary responses.
.....................
I'm so sorry that you're bored with this parade of oppression and horror. Perhaps it would have been more entertaining for you if the Jihad plot above had succeeded, and cartoonist Lars Vilks had been murdered?
more:
...Now is this a very good way to make a Muslim see your point? Not f**king likely.
.....................
If a Muslim comes to this site, sees the horrendous things done in the name of Islam, and decides to abjure Jihad, or even apostize from Islam—whether that means converting to another faith or not—all well and good.
But that is not the primary purpose of Jihad Watch. Its main purpose is to educate Infidels to the growing danger of the Jihad threat, and that it does very well.
I'm not sure where you fit in.
Tell ya what, al-Manac; you need to spend lots of time here reading the posts and the various books and links before you get to leap onto your high and noble horse and begin with the slings and arrows. Not gonna work here.
What's not gonna work here? If Islam is evil, then the Muslims need to be converted. End of story. What "various books" am I supposed to read? What links am I supposed to follow? I already get the gist of what Mr. Spencer and Pamela Geller and Michelle Malkin and all the rest of them are saying: Islam is Evil.
So what are any of these people doing to convert the Muslims away from this evil religion? Because if it's really that evil, then it shouldn't be too hard to do that, especially with all the money they're making.
If a Muslim comes to this site, sees the horrendous things done in the name of Islam, and decides to abjure Jihad, or even apostize from Islam—whether that means converting to another faith or not—all well and good. But that is not the primary purpose of Jihad Watch. Its main purpose is to educate Infidels to the growing danger of the Jihad threat, and that it does very well.
And once the Infidels are fully aware of the problem, what then? Do we commit wholesale genocide against 1 billion Muslims, or do we try to convert them? I would think the latter would be less morally problematic then the former.
"al-Manac" wrote:
And once the Infidels are fully aware of the problem, what then? Do we commit wholesale genocide against 1 billion Muslims, or do we try to convert them? I would think the latter would be less morally problematic then the former.
.....................
I believe "al-Manac" has just tipped his hand. "Convert or die" is a tenet of Islam when dealing with Infidels, not the philosophy of anyone I am familiar with at Jihad watch.
I believe "al-Manac" has just tipped his hand. "Convert or die" is a tenet of Islam when dealing with Infidels, not the philosophy of anyone I am familiar with at Jihad watch.
Really? If you believe that Islam is the problem with Islam, then "convert or die" are the only two choices you have in dealing with Muslims. Are you suggesting that there's a third option that I don't know about? Please inform.
"al-Manac" wrote:
If you believe that Islam is the problem with Islam, then "convert or die" are the only two choices you have in dealing with Muslims.
.................
I was right. "al-Manac" was clearly hoping someone on JW would express a desire to convert Muslims by force or mass murder them.
To quote Undaunted in response to an earlier post by "al-Manac":
"Not gonna work here."
Just who the hell are you? Several of the posters here have their own blogs and websites whereby they do what they can against the rising tide of Islam and the evil it represents and forces.
Your arrogance is what ain't gonna work here, dipshit.
Where is your website? Where is your blog? Where do we write or call to get on board whatever you're doing?
WTF are you doing besides bitching about how others are not doing what YOU are not doing?
I was right. "al-Manac" was clearly hoping someone on JW would express a desire to convert Muslims by force or mass murder them.
Well if killing them or converting them are NOT options, then what IS? What should we be doing, then?
Ignoring you seems like something we should be doing, al.
Al-Manac,
Your idea of conversion is an interesting one. Why don't you explain how you're going about doing that. I'm happy to learn a new tactic.
Uh-oh, Isabella's on the hunt.
Colleen, Jamie, WTH were you girls thinking? By now, "Ooh, hurt me some more," has taken on a whole new meaning.
I know there is a dumb blond joke in here, somewhere.
Al-Manac:
The following is a Christian fundamentalist's reply to your string of postings. "Convert or die" is not the formula that the New Testament gives us (I speak as a Christian), and the violence enjoined against Canaan in the Old Testament has been seen by a veritable army of Christian Commentators as a one-shot deal (and, in large measure, a warning to Israel what the divine justice can do if we follow the same abominations that made Canaan so abhorrent).
Jesus says, "Whoseover shall not receive you, nor hear your words, as ye go forth out of that house ore that city, shake off the dust of your feet. Verily I say unto you it shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment than for that city." (Matthew 10:14-15 ASV).
Paul says, "Render to no man evil for evil. Take thought for things honorable in the sight of all men. If it be possible, as much as in you lieth, be at peace with all men. Avenge not yourselves, beloved, but give place unto the wrath of God: for it is written Vengeance belongeth unto me; I will recompense, saith the Lord." (Romans 12:17-19 ASV).
We will therefore let God deal out the destruction, fire and brimstone in the day that He judges the living and the dead. While we may warn of Hell, it is NOT our calling to hasten anyone on his way thither. There. I think I've interpreted those texts in a "literalist, fundamentalist" manner--especially when I know enough history to know that Jesus and the first several generations of Christians didn't have the power of the sword to execute temporal judgments beyond excommunication.
Now, maybe you're the kind of secularized American who thinks that we Christian fundies are out to bring back the rack and thumbscrew the minute Pope Pat the Robertson commands us (even if half of us think he's a heretic). If so, I beg your forgiveness for any of my comments that might've brought you to such a conclusion. But, if you've reached that conclusion from our mainstream media, let me tell you that bigotry can be found even among those who consider themselves "enlightened", and we do indeed feel it.
And, there IS mission to Muslims going on even as we read and write here on Jihad Watch. Already, Iranian-American Christians of Muslim background are catching up, or even surpassing, the numbers of Iranian-American Christians of Armenian or Assyrian (traditionally Christian) heritage.
No sooner had Turkey gotten rid of 99% of its Greek, Armenian, and Syriac Orthodox, than formerly Muslim Guest Workers who had lived in Europe began introducing Evangelicalism in Turkey. There are only a few thousand now, but let's not forget the Parable of the Mustard Seed and pray that we see it happen.
Evangelical churches have started springing up among the Imazgen (Berbers) of Morocco and Algeria due to people being reached by the Gospel while sojourning in Europe.
And, when a guy like Walid Shoebat or Mosab Yousef leaves Islamic militancy for Christ, I'm sure it didn't happen because someone yelled out, "Raghead! Camel Jockey! Sandmonkey!"
In these perilous times, we Christians have a duty to show Muslims that the Gospel is a door through which they may pass to truly know God and not a club held over their heads. Come to think of it, that's a good way to deal with the Jews, Greeks (to use the two New Testament peoples), barbarians, Scythians, and everyone else. We must not spoil the Lord's fruit, no matter how impatient we get with people.
As someone who probably isn't as good a Christian as he ought to be, I admit it's hard advice. But I see it as following God's preceptive will.
BTW, everyone, in case I don't show up tomorrow, a very happy St. Patrick's Day to all and sundry.
After all, most of the Irish who introduced it to the USA back in the 1700's and early 1800's (Ancient Order of Hibernians, etc.) were Protestant!
Re. Al-Manac's remarks above.
He is not going to find out, here, just exactly what the many, many people who post here, let alone the many who read but do not post, may be doing to 1. politically, defend the non-Muslim world against the Jihad and 2. spiritually, liberate Muslims from Islam.
We are engaged in a struggle very similar to that which obtained during the Cold War.
There is, on the one hand, the necessary and sensible defence of the free non-Muslim lands and societies against a violent, expansionist ideology, a cross between a death cult and an organised crime 'family', the de facto Empire of Islam, that fully intends to snuff out human freedom and creativity and imprison all of humanity within the hell-on-earth of a sharia gulag.
On the other hand, there is the attempt to free the minds of those already enslaved by the death cult.
The governments of the free world defended their societies against the aggression of the Communist bloc and Communist infiltrators and saboteurs, by political and law enforcement means.
The Christians prayed for those deluded by Communism, and supported the efforts of groups such as Keston College, to get Bibles into Communist lands, to support the persecuted church there, and to broadcast the Gospel. There were also programs not specifically evangelistic in purpose, simply aimed at telling the truth and freeing minds.
The same two-pronged movement *is* or should happen today, in response to the Jihad: indeed, the second (the psychological/ spiritual warfare side of things) is probably far more advanced and widespread and having more of an effect (see, for example, the results in the persons of Nonie Darwish, Mark Gabriel, Daniel Shayesteh, Magdi Cristiano Allam, and Canon Patrick Sookhdeo, Walid Shoebat and the 'Son of Hamas', all of them converts to Christianity out of Islam) than the political, legal and military flounderings and flailings of our western and non-western governments who simply haven't as yet even properly identified and named the enemy.
The primary task of this website is on the practical, mundane, political/ social 'self-defence' front.
Its purpose is not to evangelise Muslims, but to enable ordinary *non-Muslim* citizens to recognise the existence and nature, origins and final aims of the Global Jihad, and the clear and present danger posed thereby.
As regards the psychological/ spiritual front: Mr Spencer has on a number of occasions drawn attention to - and praised - the sterling work being done not only by Ali Sina (whose articles are often re-posted here, and whose website is linked here), but also by persons such as the formidable Coptic priest and evangelist and critic of Islam, Fr Zakaria Botros, whose 'Life TV' , broadcast by satellite, is having a huge impact upon Muslims - and is a great source of encouragement to persecuted Christians - within dar al Islam. Any interested persons here are free to support Mr Ali Sina, or Fr Botros, to the best of their ability, or to look around and find other, similar projects.
There are many solid and reputable Christian bodies, such as the Barnabas Fund, the Bible Society and the Church Missionary Society (these are three that receive regular financial support from me and my husband) who are engaged in a ministry of encouragement and assistance to Christians within the Muslim world, and are also persistently, patiently and prayerfully engaged in Christian evangelistic witness to Muslims in many, many parts of the world.
There are also parish churches within the non-Muslim world, and individual Christians, who are trying to communicate the gospel to the Mohammedans in our midst; a task that is fraught with pitfalls, because of taqiyya, because of the law of apostasy which threatens death to every Muslim who tries to leave Islam, even in the West (see Rifqa Bary, see 'Hannah Shah'), and because many of the Muslim enclaves in the non-Muslim world are increasingly hostile toward any such attempts at evangelism (two street evangelists in a part of Britain claimed by Muslim colonisers, were physically prevented from proceeding). I have, however, myself witnessed, in the parish church I attended some years ago in a large Australian city, the baptism of a young Persian Muslim man who had abandoned Islam and embraced the Christian faith. So conversions, apostasies from Islam, *are* happening.
Mr Spencer does not need to reinvent the wheel.
And since he is a devout practising Greek Melkite Catholic, I am absolutely certain that he privately gives - and prays - sacrificially to assist the persecuted church in Muslim lands and also to assist the witness of Christians to Muslims, whether here or abroad. He is under no obligation to disclose what he does in that regard, to a blow-in like 'al-manac'. Each Christian and for that matter, each practising Jew, who posts here, is probably doing *something* on what I shall call the 'psy-ops' front. We do not have to say what.
Yea, what Dumbles said.
Moi?
Al-Manac,
Your idea of conversion is an interesting one. Why don't you explain how you're going about doing that. I'm happy to learn a new tactic.
1) Do not invade Muslim countries with massive amounts of US/Foreign troops. This has the opposite effect of what you're trying to achieve. Example: Iraqi Christians, who enjoyed a good status under Saddam Hussein, are now the target of death squads and have largely left the country in the past seven years. Other religious groups like the Izedis and Sabians have suffered similarly. So invading Iraq wasn't such a good idea in terms of protecting or encouraging religious minorities.
2) Do not overthrow the democratically elected governments of Muslim countries in order to steal their oil. This was done by the CIA in 1953 in Iran. The overthrown president's name was Mossadeq. Why do I mention this? It's because of actions like these that make it very difficult for any reform to take place in Muslim countries, let alone toleration for religious minorities. Any sort of attempted reform in a Muslim country can be interpreted very conveniently by the leaders of said country as a CIA plot against them. And in many cases, they are actually right.
3) Do not use such epithets as "inbred" or other names directed at Muslims. It's not gonna help.
Oh. Surprise. It's our fault.
Who knew?
LOL. "al-Manac", get it, "almanac", as in the Farmer's Almanac. That at least is as cleverly imaginative as some of our allied posters here, name "Haid Dasalami". I love that one. "Hide the Salami".
Anyway, chuckles aside and back on point, "al-Manac" is not a liberal peruser, but rather a full-blown mohammedan, intent on leading the disussion into the straw-man argument that since Islam is problematic...and "the problem" as he admits himself, that the only solution is forced conversions or death, just as is mandated in Islam...with the noteable exceptional non-mention of dhimmitude as the third option, is quite simply... death by global genocide against Muslims.
Bravo, al-Manac. Ibrahim Hooper himself (though it may actually be 'ol Doug after all), could not have done a better job of transparency, that is, transparency in your sad and ineffectual attempt to draw genocidal comments, albeit completely fabricated ones, to try to use to discredit this site via the community of posters here.
Nice try, mohammedan.
That said... I still love the moniker, seriously.
Oh, and the "pedophilia" thing that crops up now and again in regards to Mohammed:
People didn't marry for sex or love back then, as they do now. They married for alliance. Western royals got engaged and married at very young ages. This Spanish princess was betrothed at three and then married at eleven:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariana_Victoria_of_Spain
Her example is just one of many.
Oh. Surprise. It's our fault.
Who knew?
How pathetic can you be? Everything I mentioned was the truth. Do a google search on it, for god's sake.
Anyway, chuckles aside and back on point, "al-Manac" is not a liberal peruser, but rather a full-blown mohammedan, intent on leading the disussion into the straw-man argument that since Islam is problematic...and "the problem" as he admits himself, that the only solution is forced conversions or death, just as is mandated in Islam...with the noteable exceptional non-mention of dhimmitude as the third option, is quite simply... death by global genocide against Muslims.
If you believe that Islam is the problem of Islam, i.e. that Islam is not redeemable, then conversion or death towards Muslims are your only two options, in the end. How else are you going to deal with these followers of an irredeemably evil cult? If it's inherently evil, then it's got to GO, one way or the other.
My intent was never to "get" you to admit genocidal intent, but to get you to realize the ultimate consequences of believing that Islam is inherently evil. Eventually, you have to eradicate the evil. Bummer, huh?
Unless, of course, Islam can change. Then the equation is different. Conversion or death are not your only options.
By the way, Awake, I am not a Muslim. You came to that conclusion because you believed I wanted you (as in all of you) to admit genocidal intent. Was never my intent. You can put me into the category of "liberal peruser".
al-Maniac:
Except that Mohammed is not a "people" - he's supposed to be a Prophet. A Prophet of God.
A real Prophet of God doesn't have sexual intercourse with a 9-year-old. Mohammed was 53. Yeah, he's a Pedophile. In addition, a real Prophet of God isn't a polygamist with 13 wives.
Mohammed is a Warlord who pretended Prophethood. He's a fake, a fraud, a phony, a flim-flam man. Mo never prophesied anything. Islam is a lie, a fiction made up by the mass-murdering Warlord. Oh right - a real Prophet of God isn't a mass-murderer, he doesn't behead people because they refuse to convert to Islam.
You called undaunted "pathetic." Just who the hell do you think you are? Your "category" is: Arrogant and pompous. Aren't they missing you on Huff Post?
"Allah's Apostle was asked, "What is the best deed?" He replied, "To believe in Allah and His Apostle (Muhammad). The questioner then asked, "What is the next (in goodness)? He replied, "To participate in Jihad (religious fighting) in Allah's Cause." (Bukhari 1.2.25)
And the world is still suffering today from the Warlord's pronouncement of "Jihad" as "goodness." No, it's not - it's evil.
"Ignoring you seems like something we should be doing, al." - undaunted.
Exactly.
al-manac wrote:
"Oh, and the "pedophilia" thing that crops up now and again in regards to Mohammed:
People didn't marry for sex or love back then, as they do now."
Maybe most people didn't, but apparently Mohammed did, especially with regard to little Aisha. I have read one of the hadith in which he told Aisha that he had a vision of her (as a little girl, not when she had grown into a teenager) naked on a piece of cloth...hmmm. Sure doesn't sound "sexual", does it? (If anyone here can find and post the exact text of the hadith I'm referring to, thanks.)
Also, it is well known that Aisha's father was very reluctant to let her marry Mohammed at age six, and pleaded with him to wait until his daughter was a few years older before consummating the marriage. I can't imagine why he would have been reluctant to marry his daughter to by far the most powerful, wealthy and esteemed man in his community unless he felt uncomfortable with the idea of a man in his 50s--even Mohammed--having sex with his very young daughter. If it were strictly about alliances between families, or wealth, why would he have been reluctant? He should have been so honored that he would immediately have given her to Mohammed.
"I am not a Muslim."
Hmm, your choice of moniker suggests otherwise.
"If Islam is as truly evil as you say it is, then how come you aren't making more of an effort to convert Muslims to Christianity or any other religion?"
Your Arabic moniker aside, here's another clue which also suggests to me that you might be a muslim.
The above comment is one of several that you've made on this thread asserting that more of an effort should be made in saving muslims from evil islam. And on the surface I totally agree with you.
But! ...it's your heavy-handy style that gives you away, which is a huge red flag for me. It is such an atypical muslim approach in converting others to islam -- by force!
So, it isn't that you don't have a good point, but it's the way in which you're going about it that suggests to me that you're a muslim; given your super demanding style. You see, no one can force someone else to become a Christian, it doesn't work that way. And the fact that you obviously don't Get-That screams, "Hey look at me, folks, I'm a muslim!", because you are way too pushy.
Make sense?
Not "heavy-handy" ..I meant heavy-handed style.
Al-manac, I'm also a bit leery over a too-activist foreign policy--especially since the overthrow of Mossadegh probably saved the father's of Iran's current crop of mullahs from execution or crippling imprisonment by Mossadegh's Tudeh friends, and since a Communist Iran might well have turned into an earlier version of Afghanistan for the Soviet Union, only a generation earlier. But, hey, American leadership in those days also believed that "scientific planning" applied to political economy was the wave of the future, too.
Everyone else: Al-manac's heavy-handed, "nothing buttery" style reminds me a little more of Marxist reductionism. He accuses others of reducing people to caricatures, but engages in it himself.
Hmm...I asked you to tell us how you are going about converting Muslims and you said:
1) Do not invade Muslim countries with massive amounts of US/Foreign troops.
2) Do not overthrow the democratically elected governments of Muslim countries in order to steal their oil.
3) Do not use such epithets as "inbred" or other names directed at Muslims.
Sounds like a list of gripes and grievances, rather than a recipe for conversion. BTW, what is it that you are converting them to? Oh, and convert or die is a Muslim concept, not a Christian one so I assume you aren't planning to "convert" anyone to Christianity.
Your posts lack a logical flow. You say you're not a Muslim but you provoke like one. You also have a measure of covert hostility and frustration that causes others to be on their guard against you. You're not here to discuss but rather to ridicule and antagonize. I wonder what your stated purpose for being here is? It certainly isn't the solve the problem.
Fuck you, al.
I don't need to google anything. I know the history.
"Our fault" meant that, again, Islam blames everybody else for their murderous past. Like retards with razors they have savaged and raped in the name of their god and prophet and it's always because the infidels have it comin' just because we don't believe.
Blow it out your ass, liberal peruser. Like every liberal, you're a intellectually dishonest juvenile.
Always enjoyable undaunted's "take no prisoners" approach!
The Apologist hasn't returned, hopefully we're well-rid of him.
You stated:
"Because if you believe that Islam is evil, then that's the next logical step."
The next logical step is for you to skip on out of here ....
bubye!
The next logical step is to stand up to Muslims and tell them, no, we're not going to do it your way, no matter how much you whine or infiltrate our police departments or cry victim every time you get caught with your hand in the cookie jar. and if they don't back down we put them in jail temporarily until we can process their papers and deport them. Why should we throw them in our jails so they can use them as little jihadi school houses?
See Almanac, we're not into just murdering people to get rid of our problems, like Muslims are. But we have a right to not be burdened with people who will not assimilate and will not follow our laws. Sending them home after we make sure that they will not be able to come back into the country would be more effective and very humane. If they want to live in a hellhole let them go back to the one they came from rather than turning our country into one.
"If you believe that Islam is the problem of Islam, i.e. that Islam is not redeemable, then conversion or death towards Muslims are your only two options, in the end."
Not at all, I can think of at least one other, very effective option, one that is on display in Israel. You probably refer to it as the "Apartheid Wall."
And in case you want to misinterpret what I'm saying, I'll spell it out for clearly for you: I'm not necessarily talking about building physical walls, although in places like Israel, it is what geography dictates. What I'm talking about is non-Muslim states disallowing the current unsustainable huge influx of Muslims. What I'm talking about doesn't require genocide or conversion, just a little reciprocity (think for a moment about the immigration and citizenship policies of Gulf Arab states.)
People - I think "al-Maniac" is gone.
Good Riddance.
"al-manac" wrote:
Oh, and the "pedophilia" thing that crops up now and again in regards to Mohammed:
People didn't marry for sex or love back then, as they do now. They married for alliance.
...................
Then there should be no reason whatsoever that child "marriage" is so rife in the Muslim world today—nor that this is so in the name of the example of "the Prophet" Muhammed and his rape of little Aisha.
"Malaysia's religion minister rejects child marriage reform"
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/03/malaysias-religion-minister-rejects-child-marriage-reform.html
There are those in our midst who will attempt to throw in dissension and confusion, and al Maniac is one of them. I believe this person is a Muslim, or at least a sympathizer of Islam.
For anyone to leave Islam will take a complete change of heart and mind...it is spiritual, mostly.
I believe that only the grace of God Almighty can set anybody free from the bondage of Islam, or any other cult. But, the one must be seeking Truth, and be willing to listen and learn...and then to CHANGE! Again, with the grace of God, it is possible.
Believe, and receive.
Three problems with al-Manac's recommendation that in order to solve the problem of Islam, we should convert Muslims to another religion:
1. A grand project of trying to convert Muslims worldwide would only inflame Muslims to hate us all the more, and would therefore exacerbate the problem. (If al-Manac doesn't know this, he hasn't been reading the various news stories and analyses collected on Jihad Watch over the years.)
2. Such a project would likely not garner sufficient numbers of Muslims anyway. It's not worth the time, money and resources.
3. Such a project goes against al-Manac's own logic: he wrote:
"I do agree that there is a problem with Islam (just as there are problems with other religions).
So if all other religions have approximately the same problems that Islam has, why would converting Muslims to any other religion solve the problem? It wouldn't, according to al-Manac's position of equivalency among all religions as being roughly equally problematic.